Agency Bytes is a podcast for owners of creative, marketing, and advertising agencies that packs a ton of important agency information on one topic, from one expert into a 25-minute brief. Why 25 minutes? Because who has the attention span for much more these days, and you can squeeze in a listen between meetings with time for a bathroom break or coffee refill before your next meeting. Agency Bytes is brought to you by Steve Guberman from Agency Outsight. Steve is a 20-year agency veteran who works as a business coach for agencies around the country. He coaches owners of branding, marketing, design, and PR agencies to conquer their goals and overcome their challenges. Learn more about Agency Outsight at www.agencyoutsight.com
Episodes
Monday Jul 28, 2025
Monday Jul 28, 2025
Featuring: Shawn Johnston, Forge and Smith
In episode 121, I sit down with Shawn Johnston, founder of Forge and Smith and creator of Refoundry—a low-code WordPress platform that’s transforming how agencies build and deliver websites. We talk about how Shawn cut delivery time by 70%, turned profit margins around using the Profit First method, and transitioned his agency toward a scalable, productized model. He shares insights on navigating developer pushback, balancing client empowerment with agency control, and preparing for evolving tech shifts like AI in web development. Whether you’re struggling with project bottlenecks, shrinking budgets, or scaling challenges, Shawn’s story offers a clear path forward for building smarter, more profitable systems.
Key Bytes
• Refoundry cut Forge and Smith’s development time by 70%, transforming profitability.
• Adopting Profit First changed their approach to pricing and overhead limits.
• Client empowerment through low-code builds loyalty and drives referrals.
• Transitioning leadership allowed Shawn’s team to grow into bigger roles.
• Technological shifts (like Webflow and AI) demand constant agency adaptation.
• Productizing an internal tool opened new revenue streams beyond services.
• Balancing developer pride with client needs is critical for successful adoption.
• Early lessons in print taught Shawn to anticipate and embrace industry change.Chapters
00:01 Introduction to Shawn Johnston and Forge and Smith
02:11 Moving from freelance to full agency and early challenges
04:39 Implementing Profit First and shifting to scalable systems
06:38 Why Refoundry: Bringing low-code to WordPress
08:22 Cutting development time and improving project profitability
11:23 Developer pushback and prioritizing client empowerment
14:44 Evolving Refoundry into a product for other agencies
17:03 Transitioning leadership and building team collaboration
24:17 Preparing for tech shifts like AI and staying nimble in delivery
28:30 Rapid fire questions and final reflections
Shawn Johnston is the founder of Forge and Smith, a digital agency that’s launched over 500 websites in the past 13 years. After hitting the usual delivery bottlenecks and burnout cycles, he built Refoundry—a low-code platform for WordPress that helped his team cut build times by 70% and scale without sacrificing quality. Now he’s on a mission to help other agencies streamline delivery, boost margins, and build systems that actually work.
Contact Shawn on Forge and Smith or Refoundry.
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